Living Wholehearted

September 19, 2023

Episode 199: Healing From Church Wounds – Grace, Grace, Grace with Max Lucado

Are you feeling discouraged by your life, leadership, or church? Are you frustrated with all the broken unhealthy systems? Are you losing hope as you struggle to serve, lead, and do what is right? We get it. There is a lot of hard in the world and it’s difficult to finish the race well. You are not alone. But we have good news for you. 


Our guest today is near and dear to our hearts. His children’s book series, “You Are Special” has been a key part of our own family routine over the years, especially when our girls were younger. We even featured Punchinello and Lucia (characters from Max’s book) in Terra’s very first book, Courageous: Being Daughters Rooted in Grace, and the Courageous Girls curriculum. Max Lucado is here to bring you some much needed encouragement – wherever you are in your walk with God. Curious. Hungry. Disappointed. Angry. Burdened. Apathetic. 


Max Lucado is a pastor, speaker, and bestselling author with more than 145 million products in print, which have been translated into 56 languages and distributed across 80 countries worldwide. Known for delivering timeless messages of hope and encouragement in his signature writing style, combining poetic storytelling and homespun humor, Lucado is America’s favorite and most prolific inspirational author. Max’s latest book is titled, God Never Gives Up on You.


And stick around after the interview, as we share our insights and impressions of Max’s encouragement when it comes to healing church wounds and finishing your race well. 



To connect with Max Lucado, visit:





Facebook – @MaxLucado

Twitter – @MaxLucado

Instagram – @MaxLucado



God Never Gives Up on You: What Jacob’s Story Teaches Us About Grace, Mercy and God’s Relentless Love, by Max Lucado (Available on Sept 12th, 2023)




We LOVE that you’ve decided to join us this week for the Living Wholehearted Podcast. We hope you enjoyed the conversation, tips, and resources to help you transform every relationship that matters most to you. If you think this will help someone you know, make sure you send it their way or share on socials. Tag us @living_wholehearted and @terramattson! Don’t forget to FOLLOW/SUBSCRIBE so you don’t miss an episode and help spread the word by leaving us some stars on a review. Thanks for partnering with us to help more leaders, just like you, who want to live and lead with integrity at home, work and in the community.  Go to and sign up to receive our free leadership tips and updates delivered to you in our monthly newsletter. And, if you’re a girl mom, check out  


Until next time, be the leader you would follow!


Grateful for you,

Jeff & Terra


To connect with Jeff & Terra Mattson and Living Wholehearted, go to:














Shrinking the Integrity Gap

Shrinking the Integrity Gap e-Course

Courageous: Being Daughters Rooted in Grace

Dear Mattsons

Helping Moms Raise Confident Daughters




The Living Wholehearted Podcast is a part of the Christian Parenting Podcast Network. To find practical and spiritual advice to help you grow into the parent you want to be visit


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About Living Wholehearted

We define a leader as anyone with a following. Whether you are a parent or a CEO, or both, how you lead matters. When a leader lives with integrity, everyone in their wake benefits. And when they don't, everyone in their wake pays, it's just a matter of time. We are a husband and wife team HELPING LEADERS of all types LIVE WITH INTEGRITY through Biblical, Clinical, and Relational Wisdom. The Living Wholehearted Podcast is filled with grace, hope, and practical tools to help you in every relationship that matters most to you in your home, work, and community. Become a leader who is shrinking their integrity gap between what you say and how you actually live. Join us in the movement of becoming a Wholehearted Leader!

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About Jeff and Terra Mattson

Jeff Mattson (MA ORL) and Terra Mattson (MA LPC, LMFT) are Christian Parenting spokespeople and the co-hosts of the Living Wholehearted Podcast in the Christian Parenting Podcast Network.


After two decades studying and working in leadership and trauma-informed therapy, Jeff and Terra are bridging the gap between Biblical, clinical, and relational wisdom to help leaders live with integrity in the home, work, and community.


They are the co-founders of Living Wholehearted, a professional counseling and organizational development firm. Terra is the author of Courageous: Being Daughters Rooted in Grace and together they co-authored Shrinking the Integrity Gap: Between what Leaders Preach and Live. Jeff and Terra have skin in the game as they raise their two daughters just outside Portland, OR on five acres of old growth woods. There is never a dull moment in the Mattson home!


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